DAVID CRAYFORD -------- SOME PEOPLE, IN THIS CASE IT IS SPECIFIC PERSONS IN AMERICA; WANT EVERYTHING THEIR OWN WAY IRRESPECTIVE OF WHETHER IT IS LEGAL OR NOT ................................
........................THEY HAVE BEEN STUPID AND FOOLISH IN THE PAST TO THE EXPENSE OF ABSOLUTE NAIVETY, AND NOW THEY WANT THE GOVERNMENT TO HELP THEM, EVEN TO THE EXTENT OF THE GOVERNMENT COMMITTING AN INTERNATIONAL CRIME, AND IF SUCCESSFUL, INCREASING THE AMERICAN DEBT FACTOR YET AGAIN, WHICH IS ALREADY THE LARGEST NATIONAL DEBT IN THE WORLD AND STILL RISING ................
I refer to an article within YAHOO Finance dated May 14th 2020, under url: https://finance.yahoo.com/news/1-6t-century-old-chinese-144106166.html of which I have copied the article, in full, below:-
$1.6T in century-old Chinese bonds offer Trump unique leverage against Beijing
May 14, 2020
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As the Trump administration seeks ways to penalize China for its handling of the COVID-19 pandemic, it need look no further than Tennessee.
The Lewisburg, Tennessee-based American Bondholder Foundation holds $1.6 trillion of century-old Chinese debt, including interest, dating to before the founding of the communist People's Republic of China, that it wants the administration's help in redeeming. There is an estimated $6 trillion or more of the debt outstanding worldwide.
The bonds were issued by the Republic of China -- which ousted the imperial government in a coup -- as far back as 1912 and backed by gold; they were defaulted on in 1938. The ROC government fled to Taiwan, where it remains the official ruling body, after Mao Zedong's communist party took over following the 1949 end of the revolution.
Beijing maintains Taiwan is part of China, and under international law, successor governments are responsible for the debts of their predecessors.
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President Trump is a "'promises made, promises kept' president, and he said to my face that he was going to do this transaction, do this deal, and hold China accountable," Jonna Bianco, president and chairwoman of the American Bondholder Foundation, told FOX Business.
Bianco, who has power of attorney for 95 percent of the thousands of U.S. bondholders, said making China repay its debt would "not be punishment," but rather a basic fundamental of international finance.
There's international precedent for such a move: Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher ordered Beijing in 1987 to make good on the bonds owned by Brits or lose access to the British capital markets. Then-Chinese President Li Xiannian's government obliged, reaching a settlement of 23.5 million British pounds.
By paying some bondholders and not others, Beijing is technically in selective default, according to the ratings of bond-risk firms Moody's, Standard & Poors and Fitch. Until China pays, it cannot sell debt on the international market, Bianco said.
The U.S. and China normalized relations in 1979, but cables dating as far back as May 1973 viewed by FOX Business show the State Department told Beijing that while the debt didn't have to be paid at that time, it would not be forgiven.
There have been attempts to litigate pre-Communist party bonds in the past.
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A class-action lawsuit brought by Hukung railway bondholders was thrown out in 1979 under the Foreign Sovereign Immunity Act, which establishes limits on lawsuits against foreign governments.
Since then, developments in a few cases have suggested sovereign immunity might not be as strong with regard to certain types of debt, but those cases could be tied to specific language within the bond contracts themselves.
"It's a difficult suit to bring just because at this point, it's really very old," Odette Lienau, associate dean and professor of law at Cornell University, told FOX Business. "Technically, these don't necessarily expire, but in practice, doing something like this is going to be difficult. You have to be legally creative with how you would do it."
Bianco spent a year researching the issue and working with the White House, State Department, Securities and Exchange Commission, Federal Trade Commission, former Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist of Tennessee, former Congressman Bart Gordon and former Congressman Walter Jones when the American Bondholder Foundation was founded in August 2001.
While not widely accepted in international law, the doctrine of odious debt, which is akin to China's argument, states national debt incurred by an illegitimate regime is not enforceable.
The U.S. made a similar argument when faced with the burden of Confederate obligations following the end of the Civil War. Congress in 1868 passed the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, which says "neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States."
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While there's a "plausible legal argument" for redeeming the bonds, Lienau said, it's "politically difficult."Bianco, who met with Trump and Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin about the matter in 2018 while the U.S. and China were negotiating a phase one trade deal, said the U.S. Treasury could take the bonds in and use them to offset the nation's debt with China.
The U.S. might then say it considers the bonds paid, but China could still dispute that, bringing the two sides back to square one.
"Ultimately, this is going to have to be some kind of negotiated settlement if it gets taken up," Lienau said. "If not, the U.S. just continues making the payments on the national debt."
A spokesperson for the Treasury Department did not respond to FOX Business' request for comment.
The Foreign Bondholders Protective Council, established under former President Franklin Roosevelt in 1933, helps U.S. citizens collect on defaulted bonds from foreign governments and has settled 47 cases. If the group were to successfully resolve this case, it would be the 48th.
Bianco's clients would be willing to take "pennies on the dollar," she said, letting the rest go toward helping repay a national debt that has swelled to more than $25 trillion as policymakers have taken unprecedented action to shield the economy from fallout related to COVID-19.
The government has extended trillions of dollars of aid to combat record job losses and the sharpest contraction of the post-World War II era, caused by a virtual shutdown of the U.S. economy through stay-at-home orders intended to limit the virus' spread.
Both the Trump administration and some members of Congress have in recent weeks been looking at ways to punish Beijing for what they call an insufficient initial response to COVID-19, first identified in Wuhan, China, at the end of last year.
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FOX Business learned on Monday that the administration is forging ahead with plans to divest $4 billion of worth of equity stakes in Chinese companies held by the Federal Retirement Thrift Investment Board. But other options are limited.
"There is almost no clean-cut tool that you can use to put pressure on China without hurting ourselves," Xiaobo Lu, political science professor at Barnard College of Columbia University, told FOX Business.
Earlier this month, Sens. Martha McSally, R-Ariz., Marsha Blackburn, R-Tenn. and Steve Daines, R-Mont., introduced the Stop China-Originated Viral Infectious Disease Act, which, if passed, would give Americans the right to sue China for the damage COVID-19 has caused to the economy and human life.
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Another group of senators, led by Lindsey Graham, R-S.C., have introduced the COVID-19 Accountability Act, which would give Trump the authority to impose sanctions and travel bans, restrict loans to Chinese businesses by U.S. firms and ban Chinese companies from listing on U.S. stock exchanges.
Lu pushed back on the feasibility of those options, however, noting that the U.S. has "already done quite a bit" in terms of sanctions and that Chinese companies can list their shares in other international markets.
Fighting to collect payment on the aging Republic of China notes would have none of those drawbacks, though it might prove as arduous a struggle as negotiating a trade deal. Still, Bianco says, the U.S. would have the weight of common law and moral responsibility on its side.
"Americans pay their debts," Bianco said. "China needs to do the same."
Let me first approach this on the subject of true legal ownership, by asking the question as to "How the persons who currently have these Bonds in their possession, actually acquired them". There are in fact two primary ways:-
1. By Theft.
2. By purchasing these Bonds from people who originally stole them from either directly from the actual depository, or, from the Custodian of the specific depository.
Therein lies the problem for them.
Let me first take item 1. above. Stealing something does not mean you now have full Legal Title to what you have stolen, and can do as you please with the stolen property. In fact, the Legal Title to those Bonds legally belongs to THE GLOBAL DEBT FACILITY who are the true legal owners of those Bonds under an International Treaty dated 1935, which refers to the Bonds, Certificates, Notes issued by Sovereign Governments (including China) or by Authorities / Agencies of Sovereign Governments, prior to 1935 where such Debt upon those Governments prevented the proper expansion / development of such Sovereign Nations, and as such was generating a very high National divide all across the world. That was considered to be an embryonic trigger for generating wars and therefore needed urgent correction. In fact, at this time the world was only 3 -4 years away from World War II.
The GLOBAL DEBT FACILITY, along with the G7 Nations of the time, agreed that the Debt of these Nations (Including China with their numerous Railroad and Government issued Bonds) Should be seen to be written off completely. That is where THE GLOBAL DEBT FACILITY came in, when they purchased all these Sovereign Bonds, Certificates, Notes by using its Gold which was then paid to the Holders, which were mainly and largely Banks, Pension Funds, Insurance Companies, International Corporations, and wealthy individuals. As it transpired / resulted, THE GLOBAL DEBT FACILTY became the legal owners of all such Sovereign Debt and Sovereign Authority / Agency Debt. The resultant Bonds, Certificates, and Notes, of which there were hundreds of thousands from virtually every Nation on this planet, were stored / secreted away in depositories in several countries, until of course the crooks started to find these depositories and steal the contents of same.
However, these crooks soon realised that they could do absolutely nothing with them because the Banks at the time, would not become involved with what they knew to be stolen property (That is an era when Banks were a little more honest then to what they are today).
I will now attend to point 2 above, as it directly results from point 1 above.
The Thieves soon realised that they had what could be referred to as "Toilet Paper" on their hands, but they had actually incurred costs with these Bonds, so somehow they needed to cover their costs.
They established small Investment companies and other outlets to dispose of these Chinese Bonds, and of course, other Sovereign Bonds, Certificates, and Notes. Fortunately for the real thieves there were more than enough gullible Mr. General Public around all trying to make their millions and were willing to make what they considered a safe investment with Sovereign Debt, believing what they were told by the real crooks as there was no way whatsoever that Mr. General Public could ever access "Top Secret" information. The deals were done and Mr. General Public was well and truly "Ripped Off".
Now, Mr. General Public of America wants his money and profits and expects the US Government to help him, which can only end up as more debt for America,
NO CHANCE whatsoever, so take your "Toilet Paper" and cry. You may ask as to why if the American Government become involved why it will end up as more Debt for America. Easy Answer. Because as of 1st June 2020 all GLOBAL DEBT FACILITY assets were revalued in the new GOLD BACKED GLOBEC CURRENCY and as such can only be traded, sold, disposed of using the new GOLD BACKED GLOBEC CURRENCY, and only by THE INTERNATIONAL TREASURY CONTROLLER, which America does not have access to for such matters concerning Assets of THE GLOBAL DEBT FACILTY so it will need to trade same in US Dollars which, as of 1st June 2020 is illegal and a criminal act, as is unlawful possession of stolen property legally owned by THE GLOBAL DEBT FACILTY, for which the penalties, both criminal and civil are a minimum 30 years imprisonment, or death for Treason against a "Sovereign".
So, the solution is not as simple as asking the Government for help, or even getting the Government involved. It is in fact far more complex for all of those Americans involved with this Theft and Fraud against THE GLOBAL DEBT FACILITY.
Finally, Donald Trump, nor any other President of American has any unique leverage over China on this matter and China knows it, so America will only make itself look bigger fools than it already is.
Those persons promoting all of this need to do their research and stop giving these people, as holders in possession of STOLEN PROPERTY, hope where there is no hope at all.
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